Good ballpark articles this week, everyone.
- Baseballparks.com (Joe Mock) just named their Ballpark of the Year for 2010. And the winner is… BB&T Ballpark in Winston-Salem, NC. What/where/why? you ask? Read the review and the press release (PDF). And note that one of the firms involved was none other than 360 Architecture. BB&T Ballpark won out over Target Field and several other minor league parks. Mock tends to like the retro look, so you may feel different. In any case, both are worth a read. Update: In a previous thread, craiger [hat tip] mentioned that 2009 award winner (and 360 project) Huntington Park in Columbus, OH, has a RF colonnade reminiscent of what has been conceived for Diridon. Take a good look at this pic and ask yourself if you want the brick façade treatment on the exterior, the unadorned columns on the interior, or something in between? It should also be pointed out that the ballpark is a companion piece to another 360 project, Nationwide Arena.
- The Braves are good, but the crowds aren’t. Where’s John Rocker when you need him?
- SI writer and Minnesota boy Steve Rushin waxes much more poetically than me on Target Field.
- Eminem and Jay-Z are doing a sort of home-and-home, hip hop, ballpark concert series at Comerica Park (this coming weekend) and Yankee Stadium (the following weekend). B.o.B. opens.
- Among the revelations at the McCourt divorce proceedings: Frank McCourt planned to slash the Dodgers’ payroll in 2006 to $85 million to stem losses. Dodger Divorce has more. (Here’s an idea, Selig: let Mark Cuban and some big money people buy the Dodgers. Just a suggestion. Then we’ll have the wonderful symmetry of David Boies, who is representing Jamie McCourt, destroy Frank, forcing him to sell to Cuban and Co., who take over the Dodgers and go on to destroy Bill Neukom’s Giants. Dee-licious.)
- Escondido continues to figure out whether or not bringing the Padres AAA franchise in would be worth it.
- Speaking of the Pads – they want no part of a soccer match at Petco during a pennant race. I’m sure that Larry Baer won’t regret the Cal Bears playing at AT&T next year, especially if the Giants continue to bring in defensive liabilities to play the outfield.
- Rosenblatt Stadium says goodbye tomorrow.
You’re welcome. I feel like Trey Kerby all of a sudden.
newballpark.org 
Re: Escondido,
Much like what SJ will be doing with Cisco Field/A’s, redevelopment funds used to spur/encourage further development and economic growth IS EXACTLY WHAT THEY WERE INTENDED TO BE USED FOR! We haven’t heard the “straw man” arguments in awhile, but it bugs the heck out of me when people refer to land acquisitions and infrastructure improvements as “direct public subsidies for rich owners” or “we should be using that money for schools, libraries, and to feed the poor.”
By the way, BB&T Ballpark is one fine venue!
The Braves are complaining because they’re only averaging 30K. We’d kill for that. The paltry “crowds” in two games last week that the writer holds up as examples of pathetic attendance would raise our season average. A’s attendance has a long way to go to just get up to “disappointing.”
looking at that pic, I don’t like the colonnade
@Zonis – Can you be more specific?
How about this pic?
I’ve warmed up to the colonnade feature. It’ll provide a great view of the field. Vantage points aside, the colonnade will also provide a lot of space for decoration. I think the brick façade is over-done in ballparks now. I also don’t want to see it covered with dark green padding. I’d like to see renderings with championships and retired numbers painted on the brick. I’d also be cool with ivy growing down the side. Some living, breathing plant-life would be a nice touch.
@ Briggs–huge fan of the colonnade here—this is the type of character that will distinguish this park from the more recent trends. Also agree with your ivy suggestion—that would make an awesome addition to this feature—combining some of the best features of Wrigley and Fenway—not bad models to follow–
@ Bay Area A’s
Thanks for the pic. Something similar to the Hamburger Balcony would be great in the RF/CF power alley at Cisco Field. It’d be nice to see those fences come in to at least 365′. Hopefully marketing/sponsorship will be kind and the it a better name than Hamburger Balcony.
@Briggs – FYI Wendy’s is based in Columbus. There is an obvious place for a GAP ad there somewhere given who’s involved.
Lot’s of Giants bashing going on … Is this the inferiority complex I hear Giants fans accusing the A’s fans of having?
@Dan (not the normal Dan who posts here) – if the Giants want to be obstinate, so can everyone else. They can also show some class if they want, no one’s stopping them.
Dan, A’s fans have nothing to feel inferior about. It is more directs at Bill Neukom for trying to drive the A’s out of the market altogether. You know, the whole Microsoft approach.
@ Dan
Is that hate bait I smell?
So now that I have seen the concept of a colonnade in both renderings and an actual stadium… I have to say, the one in the actual stadium isn’t that cool. That isn’t to say that it won’t be better in a big league park.
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I really, really like the Columbus park, but the colonnade there is underwhelming. It looks sort of like some chimneys strung together by scaffolding and a patio roof. My favorite part of that particular stadium is left field. I love that thing with bleachers bored into it.
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The colonnade in the Cisco Field renderings seem to be a lot more grand in scale… Both taller and wider. I imagine the sheer magnitude of the Cisco Field version will decrease the “chimney” look to the columns. I’d rather they did something entirely different than brick. Go with a Spanish style/adobe looking column to tie into the history of Mission San Jose/Santa Clara/Dolores/San Rafael, etc.
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I am not sure about what to do below the home run line, but green pads are fine by me and I would prefer them to ivy. That is just too Wrigley Field and I want something all our own.
With the presumably brick buildings encasing Cisco Field, a brick colonnade would be overkill with that motif. I like the idea of a mission-style motif to the colonnade but since it would be so large, a Spanish style motif might look out of place since buildings actually employing those materials were seldom more than 2 stories tall. Also, it would have to jive with the other surrounding brick buildings.
A modern, minimalist steel and glass motif might work, but it could also come off as cold and stern. I’d like to see a version with some sort of Greco-Roman column motif. It would tie in with the Coliseum aspect of their history. Also, it would be a suitable motif for a structure that sheer and tall.
@Briggs/Jeffrey – When you say surrounding brick buildings, do you mean away from the site or on site?
From the looks of things, three sides of the ballpark will be encased in brick. The west side, which faces the substation, has to be either brick or concrete. That means the east side (and perhaps the north) can be distinctive. But how to marry brick with something else without it looking like a bad addition to your house?
Personally, I think Mission revival would be cool, but does it work? Or does it stick out like a sore thumb?
I think a Mission revival motif would fit great with the surrounding city. There are several buildings in the downtown core that have that revival/faux mission motif to them, the most obvious of which is the Civic Center a few blocks away. It would definitely work.
Shibe Park had what I was trying to describe with the Greco-Roman motif. Columns like these:
If the colonnade were to adopt this motif, it’d have to be less busy but I think it’d be cool to see something along these lines. I think it would an easy way to tie in some history and majesty into the ballpark. I also think it could jive with the brick on the north, west and south ends of the ballpark. Even though it’d be a neo-retro affectation, when coupled with the rest of the ballpark, I still think it’d have a modern edge.
The colonnade just makes me disoriented. It makes me feel like I am leaning one way or the other.
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It also makes it look cheap to me for some reason, reminding me greatly of looking at the chain link fence (with wooden or plastic posts in them so you can’t see through them) at the Coliseum behind the stands in the outfield. Just sort of a ‘you can see through them, but not enough to see anything worthwhile’ and a ‘we’re too cheap to build the whole thing’ feel.
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Even having something like this might be better http://farm4.static.flickr.com/3034/3083107636_e58e0f880e_o.jpg
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or even having something like these suits you had a pic of out there, re-textured to fit. https://newballpark.org/wp-content/uploads/2010/08/002-Portland-SuitesUp.jpg
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I agree with Briggs that the Shibe Park facade he showed in that picture would look great out there.
Just spent the night at Coors Field-walking around the ballpark and imagining the proposed Cisco Field in SJ has me even more amped about the proposed design. Coors Field seats about 50k–and so far averages about 35k/night—thats 70% of what it holds—tonight was no different–probably less than 35k–and because the place is so large there was no energy in the park–lots of wasted space on the concourse—batting cages, pitching cages—only a few people using them—and what I took away is that its like a trophy house—impressive but hollow—no character—nothing that defines that you are in some place special. So with limited insight here are a few things that I think will be awesome in San Jose:
34000 capacity—-2 things about this—the ballpark will be full on most nights…I would rather have a 34k ballpark 90% filled on average than a 50k ballpak filled at 60-70% capacity on average–too many empty seats…AND…most importantly assuming season tickets are what I think they will be..those in attendance will be A’s fans–not the opponents fans. I will never forget the 2003 playoffs where Red Sox fans took over the Coli in the crucial game 5—felt like I was at Fenway—never want to feel that way again on the A’s home field. The A’s deserve a ballpark where the number of fans in attendance average 30+k/season and 90+ % are A’s fans…what I was able to visualize at Coors was removing most of the 3rd deck and how much that would help that ballpark out—scale it down a bit–make it more inviting–bring in the rest of the area around it–for those who are concerned about a claustrophic feel than Coors isn’t your design-it is pretty much totally enclosed.
Second–I know some are questioning “The Colonnade”–it will be incredible–and it will define this ballpark as different than all the others built since Camden Yards including ATT (haven’t seen Target)–Camden Yards is real—most of the others since then are forced–even AT&T–awesome location—but something about it is gimicky—cookie cutter approach with different exterior features–but the proposed SJ park with the Colonnade, with its sweeping curve to match Autumn Pkwy, will definetely set it apart–I might disagree with Briggs on the Greco-Roman motif–would seem a bit forced to me–make it a modern day version of the Roman Colisiem—-but don’t try to copy it—
Finally–the entrance has got to be grand—like ML talked about in his Target Field post when you walk into the ballpark you want to feel that you have arrived and it opens up to you—walking into Coors tonight you end up on a concourse behind home plate—just didn’t have the feel of entering something special–you get that feel even in the Tank when you enter the front with its soaring 10 story tall glass entry and take the escalators up to the concourse—Cisco Field in SJ with its center field plaza–if done properly–will be an incedible entrance into this ballpark.
From my perspective I’m more excited than ever that this design will truly set the A’s ballpark apart from most of the rest that have been built recently—ML said it earlier–its one of those designs that either your gonna love or hate…but once built—and once inside I will think it will be one of the tops in all of baseball.
(btw_-as awkaward as the left field seats appear in the renderings Coors has something somewhat similiar—the seating angles are actually pretty good from what I could take away tonight)
What the heck is that “High Sierra Park” rendering from?
coors is the exception for many of these newer parks built.
i’d guess most parks’ capacities over the past decade especially have been in the 40K range, the one huge exception is the new Yankee Stadium. agreed that a 50K park isn’t what you want, but i think a park between 36K -38K would be just about right. pnc and target, two parks that have and are getting rave reviews are of the smaller intimate parks.
the only park where i think they downsized the capacity was the chisox when they completely reconfigured their upper deck whom many criticized was way too steep.
as for the entrance, agreed, i’d love to see some a’s history showed in that plaza area behind CF if that is indeed gonna be the main entrance. would love to see statues featuring the “faces” of the a’s org like a rickey and or mack.
a’s have so much history but haven’t at all celebrated as much as other teams have done. hopefully they do so with this new sj park.
@ Jeffrey: http://www.dreamstadiums.com/
No doubt the folks over at 360 have their work cutout for them. They need to design something which is unique, yet not so unique that it looks quirky and out of place.
I personally don’t care for the colonade. To me, it looks like the scaffolding you see on the facade of a high rise building undergoing rennovation. The fact that it extends from Park Ave. to RC field doesn’t help either. In my opinion it just doesn’t look substantial enough. I wonder how the flow of pedestrian traffic would be affected with all of those columns lining Autumn street?
On second thought, from the looks of the colonnade and given they want to fit in 3 levels of about a 14 mini-suites, there’s not much leeway in terms of superficial aesthetic. The columns/separating beams between each mini-suite would have to be fairly thin to accommodate that many of them. So, that pretty much rules out having an actual column motif on the colonnade.
As far as material for the lower half of the colonnade goes, I’m ok with brick. Practically speaking, there aren’t a whole lot of options to choose from. It sure isn’t gonna be stucco or marble and brick is a whole lot better than dark green padding (which would already be covering the first 6 ft of the wall).
It would be great if 360 released their 3-D model to the public.
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@fc : Off the cuff, I don’t think the flow of foot traffic would be too congested between the colonnade and Autumn. AT&T Park is pressed right up against Embarcadero. Given that that Muni constantly holds up car traffic with fans crossing the street and Embarcadero/King is the main artery to/from North Beach, it’s always surprising to me how that many people can funnel in/out of the AT&T Park without causing a complete traffic nightmare. So, just based on that, I don’t think the car or foot traffic along Autumn would be that bad. Bird Ave is pretty spacious. They could even close Autumn between San Fernando & Montgomery to cars around game-time since it’s such a small stretch with not much else around.
BTW pro-San Jose guys, the name San Jose A’s doesn’t even sound good. Might as well change it to the San Jose Bees (remember them?). Better yet, get an expansion team for San Jose and start your own legacy/tradition, instead of trying to hijack Oakland’s. A’s belong in Oakland where they’ve had the most colorful teams in MLB history, and most success winning wise and support wise. Philly and KC are doing okay with their teams, so I don’t feel too bad. And wouldn’t it be cool when the A’s get their new JLS park, they’ll play a day/night double header with the Giants and players/press and fans travel by ferry to the others ballparks, reviving the days of the Oaks and Seals in the old PCL days. Think Green I say.
30K tonight at the coliseum and there’s just a good atmosphere with actual crowd noise there which normally isn’t there. course it’s a fireworks night so that’s probably why a good 20k extra are there but in previous fireworks night the a’s could barely draw 20K.
still having good crowds to play in front of has to be a welcoming sight for a’s fans especially when those fans are rooting for you!
even if cisco field capacity is in the mid 30s making it one of the smaller parks in baseball, even if you get mid 20s K on weeknight games which would sometimes double and triple what the a’s get now, would def be a huge boost to the a’s player’s morale.
Where are you getting 30k from? Announced attendance tonight (per ESPN) was 23,401.
my mistake, i thought i heard kuiper on air say 28K. still not 30K but if the a’s can pull even 23K at any new park on weeknight games where they are drawing less than half of that, be great.
the feeling around the park when even the park is remotely filled has to be a morale boost to a’s players and heck even alot of a’s fans attend who have to deal with mostly a dead atmosphere on most weeknight games.
San Jose Athletics sounds just fine. That way they can copy Oakland and hijack Philadelphia and Kansas City’s tradition and legacy.
“BTW pro-San Jose guys, the name San Jose A’s doesn’t even sound good. Might as well change it to the San Jose Bees (remember them?). Better yet, get an expansion team for San Jose and start your own legacy/tradition,”
Are you serious?
Unfortunately, he is serious FC…. Every blog needs a resident troll
@Jeffrey–San Jose A’s is a tad better than Silicon Valley A’s of Fremont. How about keeping the Oakland name if they go to San Jose? The 49ers will still be SF when they go to Santa Clara. If the Raiders join them over ther, they would still be Oakland Raiders.
@fc–I thought SJ is the biggest/best sports market without a big 3 sports team– So, yes, I am serious. We’ll see how they hold up against SF and Oakland’s new ballpark in the long run. I”m all for it as long as Wolff sells the A’s and gets his own SJ franchise, the Bee’s. The A’s and Bee’s in the playoffs…lol.
@LarryE–I’m no troll, just a true Oakland A’s guy who’s passionate about my team and city. If you can’t accept that, so be it. I know you guys want ML to boot me off like other outspoken pro-Oakland guys, so it can be San Joe ballpark talk on here all the time. I know I’m in the minority here, but I’ve been in the underdog roll for 42 years and counting now.
humm–Golden State Warriors—time to rename them the San Francisco Warriors and return to them to SF—Oakland Raiders—-Los Angeles Raiders sounds so much better—and yes—San Jose A’s has a great ring to it—
Random factoid: If the A’s relocate to San Jose, they’ll be the MLB franchise with the most relocations.
@GoA’s–So Oakland will have no teams at all? San Jose A’s sounds good if you’re totally deaf I guess.
@Briggs–Well, they shouldn’t relocate then. Keep them in scrappy Oakland, where they’ve had their best years and biggest fan support, even though it’s waning due to old park, bad owners and ever changing players.. SJ will never beat Oakland’s record of 2.9 million fans in that tiny Cisco ballpark he knows he can”t fill year in and year out, that’s why the small capacity. I’d rather have them in a 42k capacity park with some elbow room some days than a little bandbox packed where you can’t breath.
doubt wolff cares about if he draws 3 million.
2.5, which would be around 30K on average for a 81 game home schedule is good enough for him especially if those luxury boxes are sold out with all those sj corporations/companies buying them up, something that isn’t happening at the coliseum.
“I’d rather have them in a 42k capacity park with some elbow room some days than a little bandbox packed where you can’t breath.”
What does overall capacity have to do with individual space to move around?
“If the Raiders join them over ther, they would still be Oakland Raiders.”
I doubt it.
So what has kept Kaiser or Clorox from buying the naming rights to the Coli today? How many of those Oakland corporations that have pledged a whopping $500k (Cisco alone has pledged $120M+ in San Jose) are actually current box owners or advertisers in the Coli?
@jk-usa, It may surpise you to know that I would have no problem attending a game at JLS or VC if the A’s were denied access to SJ. I just want to see the team stay in the Bay Area. The unfortunate thing though is that I fear the team would probably explore their options outside of the Bay Area, before moving back to Oakland.
@NamTurk–There’s no way the Raiders would change names if they move to SC, but will stay in Oak I believe. They just need an all football stadium like the A’s need an all baseball park. Did you see how bad that field was last night? And the dirt infield for Raiders games while the A’s still play– ughh. A revamped Coli with the baseball side redone for football, and bigger and better scoreboards will work fine. In SC, I’m not sure there would be much tailgating in that sterile business park area. Raider fans love their tailgating and it’s an awesome site driving by it. Just wish more fans would attend games. If they start off good, i think they may sell out some games.
What makes you think the Raiders, of all teams, would remain loyal to the Oakland name? Hell, they were more popular as the Los Angeles Raiders. They currently sit near the bottom of the league in franchise value. They wouldn’t even need to change their logo, unlike the Niners. Their image is “Raiders,” not “Oakland.”
@NamTurk–you’re right, Oakland don’t mean jack. Change their name to Silicon Valley Raiders of Santa Clara. The merchandise will be literally flying off the shelves!!
I’m sure they’d come up with something better than that, but I don’t see the need right now. They’re fine in Oakland, so relax.
jk- Why do you always respond to things with sarcasm? It has nothing to do with what Oakland means to us. Al Davis has a history with a lack of loyalty and patience. He’d drop the name Oakland in a heartbeat.