Before I head out to Maryvale today to catch some combo major league and A’s minor league action, I wanted to post a table showing the approximate walking distances from various rail transit stations to ballpark entrances. In most cases these are door-to-door, measured with Google Earth’s ruler (path) tool. I’ve only included ballparks which have adjacent or nearby (within 1 mile) subway, light rail, or commuter rail stations. Bus stops do not count. The one exception I’ve included is Dodger Stadium just to illustrate the distance.
I measured the Howard Terminal distance using the approximate location of the ballpark in the Manica Architecture drawings. An infill BART station built at Market/Brush Streets between 4th and 5th would be around 1/4 mile away from Howard Terminal.
In case you’re curious, the distance from Lew Wolff’s Coliseum North ballpark concept to the Coliseum BART station would’ve been around 2/3 mile. Fremont Pacific Commons would’ve been 1.5-2 miles from the Warm Springs BART station depending on infrastructure. A ballpark at Warm Springs is unknown because there was no specific location unveiled. The San Jose Diridon ballpark site sits 500 feet from the Diridon Caltrain station and 800 feet from the San Fernando light rail station. The under-construction Berryessa BART station is nearly 4 miles away from Diridon.
With the Phase I extension of BART to Santa Clara County in about three or four years, it should become much easier and quicker taking public transit from Oakland and other East Bay communities to the proposed new A’s ballpark at Diridon Station. ML, do you or anyone else have a guessing estimate of how long it would take traveling BART from downtown Oakland to Barryessa Station and then connecting to vTA Light Rail or Express Bus to Cisco Field?
You can also add Amtrak Commuter (Capitol Corridor) to Diridon/Cisco Field as well, which (until BART makes it all the way to DSJ) might be a good alternative for fans coming from the East Bay. Current CC scheduling is inconvenient, especially for night games at Cisco Field, but perhaps we could see more trains/better frequency post 2018.
Any particular reason why “Howard Terminal” was included in the main graph? Especially since it (like Cisco Field, Pac Commons, Coliseum North) doesn’t exist.
There’s been a lot of “Howard Terminal is easy to get to” memes going around lately. Especially on Twitter. I imagine this has something to do with why it is included. It’s lame… Howard Terminal, as it is, has accessibility issues for pedestrians and small cars. That’s not to say it isn’t fixable, the question is how is it fixed and what does that cost? The now way old HOK study pegged the number at $177M in 2002. I can’t see how it is cheaper now… The infill BART station would cost more than that on it’s own.
@Tony D., Thanks!
BART has many advantages over Amtrak(Capitol Corridor) and would serve the transportation needs of those Bay Area fans who take public transit to/from sporting events. As you stated, BART schedules more trains throughout the system. BART is well accessible to many East Bay communities. BART is relatively fast and less expensive than Amtrak, even with a required light rail or bus connection at Berryessa to get to Cisco Field.
I’m a pretty pro-Oakland guy but the Oakland Only folks are making us look bad with their myopic view of everything.
Having said that, 4 miles from Bart is a LONG way in San Jo. Will there be shuttles from there to Diridon? not all of us live on a Caltrain route.
my 10 billion dollar plan is still available for sale, if you get me the investors, btw ML
When it comes to the proposed Howard Terminal ballpark site, it is not only the distance to the nearest BART station(12th Street/Broadway) that has to be measured. We have to make sure that the pedestrian walkways between the nearest BART Station and ballpark site are safe and unobstructed for walking traffic. The infrastructure for both pedestrian and vehicular traffic doesn’t exist in and around Howard Terminal. This is due to the fact that the infrastructure immediately around HT was previously designed for industrial usage.
the problem with the pro oakland guys (not all of them) is their unrelenting fanaticism. I am all for a workable solution in Oakland (which I think exists at the coliseum without the Raiders), but reactionary arguing with illogical dreck isn’t productive. I made a joke tweet comparing them to second amendment absolutists and it wasn’t but a day later that one of them proved the point entirely by taking an out of context tweet and labeling ML a McCarthyist. You know that group of people is completely unhinged and not worth a second of discussion when they make ridiculous statements like that. “Gun nuts” say “Everyone should own a gun and it makes the world safer. If you don’t agree you are a Nazi.” Oakland Only guys say “The A’s should be in Oakland no matter what and if you don’t agree you are a Joe McCarthy.” It’s just ridiculous… I’m sure some have read this post by ML and are convinced he is a Nazi for pointing out the truth.
I just revisited an old post I wrote about the A’s and transportation options from the East Bay to San Jose. It’s depressing to read from a whole bunch of perspectives.
US Cellular has two more options: The Metra/Rock Island commuter train line has a stop at 106 West 35th St., just a couple hundred feet past the Red Line/35th St. stop. That’s a definite option for those coming from the South Suburbs. (Metra stations have parking, L stops,,,not so much.) About two blocks east of that is the Green Line/35th St. stop, a common alternative if you’re starting or ending off from the elevated sections rather than the Red/Blue line subways.
Wrigley has three other L stops within 0.6 of a mile: Brown Line/Southport , Brown/Red/(Purple) Lines/Belmont and Red Line/Sheridan. They all get some ballpark game day use; depending on your destination, avoiding the crush at Addison and getting on a train *before* it goes through Wrigleyville can be a wise move.
@ Jeffrey I here you the Pro/Only Oakland folks can really be something else, it’s bothersome to me for that group to dismiss San Jose when every bit of evidence we have suggest that San Jose is the best place in the Bay Area for the A’s to play from an economic standpoint, and I say that as a Pro – Oakland fan, at some point it needs to be about the A’s and not San Jose or Oakland because if they leave the Bay Area we all loses. The Pro/Only folks in either camp need to get over it, can we get a dog on ballpark park someone in the Bay Area please.
I ride my bike down to Howard Terminal a lot. Mostly for sunsets. It’s a nice spot. Oakland used to shoot their 4th of July fireworks down there.
And for coffee. If you work their deals, World Market is pretty sweet.
When we get a rare snow, you can see Mission Peak.
They used to unload Toyotas there, mostly. It’s a prime piece of real estate.
Why the bias towards rail? Bus is used in far more cities than rail.
@4Libertee, do you have data that shows how many sports spectators go to sporting events on busses? I am not disputing your point.
@Jeffrey/4Libertee – For baseball games, regular public transit buses are not a heavily used mode. Capacity is much smaller than rail and frequency usually isn’t enough. Shuttle buses that take fans from parking lots help, but they are not what would normally be considered public transit. A full-length, 10-car BART train can carry up to 2,000 passengers including standees. If they all got off at a single station, it would take 40 buses to service just that one train’s passengers. Even then, that’s only 5% of a typical sold-out ballpark crowd.
@4Libertee, I understand the limitations of rail transportation. For one thing, the big drawback is that rail lines are area specific. One has to live in close proximity, and also their destinations have to be in close proximity to rail lines in order to get the most out of rail transit. To get the most out of a particular rail transportation system it must have connections to light rail, bus, and other forms of public transit in order to have the most extensive geographical coverage. The big advantage to rail transit is that it is very quick, relatively inexpensive fares, and does not have to deal with road traffic issues. The extension of BART to Santa Clara County, along with VTA bus and light rail connections, will have the effect of bringing the South Bay much closer to the rest of the Bay Area.
PS- I’m not responding to shit on twitter about what I comment here. Go troll someone else who gives a shit what you think.
@Jeffrey – I won’t respond to guys whose only purpose is to propagandize Howard Terminal and have no accountability. (Read it and learn, anonymous clown)
I just don’t get why people think Howard Terminal is such a slam dunk (on other media/news outlets), ok I understand why people like the idea, it’s cool and could finally bring life to Jack London Square, sounds exciting I would love it myself, but a lot of these folks act like the only problem with the site is Lew Wolff being to stubborn to build on it, really?
If lew Wolff wanted to build at Howard Terminal more than anything on earth, guess what? He still may not be able to get it done, that’s just how challenging it could be.
@ML, Are you saying that the BART connections(express bus, light rail) between Berryessa Station and Cisco Field will be inadequate to handle a normal flow of BART riding fans to the ballgame?
@LSN- if CC is given to the Raiders than HT becomes the last call for Oakland- that’s why they are promoting the heck out of it-
Also because the owner of the land adjacent is pushing it. And he has a good at PR, well connected Seantor’s son helping him.
$177M is for all the work required in the area (which included land acquisition). Infrastructure work was $150M. These numbers I am quoting from memory and they may be off a little.
The contention the parking garages and massive street improvement are not needed is not my understanding of the reality. I know that folks are arguing this, but that is based in a parking garage that is about a mile away. MLB has a requirement for on site parking (for the rich dudes and the press and such). That at a minimum.
If you want more than that, google “BART feasibility Jack London Sqaure” and there is another report, done by BART that assesses the transportation situation in and around the Port of Oakland. It rules out a BART station ($250M in 2004, again this is from memory. Feel free to look it up) and recommends a non profit Street car system as an alternative (an awesome project but also not cheap, google broadway streetcar or Oakland streetcar and you can find current numbers, or read the blogpost on my blog JeffreyAugust.worpdpress.com titled “On What We Can Do…”). This is for cost reasons and because it is clear that accessibility is an issue that holds JLS back from being a true regional hub.
My name is Jeff August and I don’t hide behind fake twitter handles, or multiple aliases across the web. I don’t care who knows what IP Address I post from.
Agree with Go A’s re HT; it’s Oakland’s last stand for the A’s. HT is just like SF’s waterfront…from the Bay View to Mission Rock! Point: just because a parcel is on the water does not necessarily make it desirable. Post-Apocalyptic, rusty industrial best describes Oakland’s waterfront north of Cost Plus/JLS (IMHO).
The more I think about it, the more I think Mt. Davis will be incorporated into a new Raiders stadium; hence Mark wanting to build on the exact current site of the Coli. Get it done Oakland!
Good news everyone! Howard Terminal has been bought and paid for according to random anonymous people on Twitter.
Tony, the tea leaves seen to be pointing to the Raiders leaving Oakland all together. Seems Mt. Davis will be empty and costing $20M a year to local governments. Or, in other words, nothing new.
Enjoy your day everyone, it is almost Opening Day!
Mark Davis says it’s almost imposable for the A’s to play in the old coliseum, while a new one is being built (so much for those place holders Mayor), it would seem that Oakland may have a choice to make in the very near future, if the Raiders stadium can pencil out.
The Oakland Athletics 5-10 year lease extension, with no commitment to coliseum city or anywhere in Oakland/Alameda County.
The Oakland Raiders will be main tenant in coliseum city build new coliseum, which will keep the team in Oakland for 30-40 years or longer.
As I have been saying for some time, Oakland would be stupid to go with the A’s, if Wolff’s proposal is give me a 5-10 year lease extension, and “I might think about developing the coliseum property , not really sure, we will have to think about it”.
Again this may be the one and only time that Oakland should actually put the Raiders before the A’s, which is a shame because up to this point the A’s have deserved so much better than they have received from Oakland and its politicians, but if this is true the Raiders willing to make a commitment, and the A’s not willing to make a commitment it’s a no brainer…
I think the Tea leaves point to everyone leaving Oakland. But really, the Raiders are perhaps the last hope for Oakland retaining a major sports franchise, especially considering they want to stay and the city has already invested in them. My Raiders leave and it’s over for The O..